Int.national horse "Quality Test" - please comment

[gespenst, FIN (admin)]

I have been thinking for a while of a kind of a quality testing for sim horses, underlining internationality in evaluation. I don't know if Americans have anything relative to this kind of testing, but I think the Premiering of SISF might be something like it. Let's call it a quality test, but I don't know if there is a better word?

But shortly, the horses would be evaluated in several areas and given points for them. The total points are counted to know what title will the horse earn, if any. In Finland our "tests" use I, II and III-titles, e.g. our dressage horse test, called shortly KRL, gives KRL-I for the best, then KRL-II or KRL-III depending on the points. A title like that increases the appreciation of a horse in breeding and the pedigree.

(I'd love if we had titles such as SHI-I, -II, -III

- - -

So, here are some ideas for the test areas and point system. Please tell, if you have something in mind to add or edit! I'm open for all ideas and suggestions. I hope we can end up in a test program which suits for horses from all over the world.

Pedigree
- 2 points for each linked sim horse parent
- 1 point for all linked sim horses further in the pedigree up to 3rd generation?
- 2 additional points, if one parent or both are from abroad
- 1 additional point, if any other horse in pedigree from abroad

Offspring
- 2 points for every foal with a working link, max. 10 points
- 1 extra point for a foal, if he lives abroad

Show record
- 0,5 points for every show result found on page, maximum points 15/20?
- some extra points for a certain amount of 1st places?
- 0,5 extra points for a result from abroad / internationally, max. 5-8 points?

Evaluation
- Diploma 6p
- Class I 4p
- Class II 2p
- Class III or no evaluation - no points
- SISF Exteriörbedömning accepted or not?

Behavior and chacteristics?
- some kind of description of horse needed
- a judge from the same country examines with points from 1-5/1-10?, how good is the horse to handle and ride according to the description

- - -

We would need atleast one judge from these countries: Finland, Sweden, German speaking country, English speaking country.

Everyone feel free to comment - are you interested, what are your opinions in the evaluation areas and the unsure parts there, should something there be changed? Thank you for everyone, evety reply is a great help!

[Heikku [fin]]

Sounds good. You just forgotted the photos (I have no idea how to say this), so what the horse looks like. Also it would be good to improve the copyright things here in simstables - like "there have to be right copyrightmarkings under the photos". It sounds funny but it's important thing.

And about the horses pedigree, if I own a horse which has only parents in virtualworld, what points the horse gets then. It's not right that horses with short pedigrees are less "good".

[gespenst, FIN (admin)]

Heikku, the photos count in the Evaluation part ; )
Copyrights are important, but for example I have also myself some photos about which the photographer has said that no crediting needed. It might be a bit hard to prove if a photo is legal or not.

In Finland the horses with no linked pedigree get points for the description of parents. But its judging is too difficult to take into this testing.

But I promise, the points system will go so that a horse can get prize I with no linked pedigree.

But hey, how about if a horse without linked pedigree could get some points if his pedigree doesn't have real life lines? =)

[Leila (GER)]

Oct 23, 2011 6:17:43 GMT gespenst, FIN (admin) said:

Heikku, the photos count in the Evaluation part ; )
Copyrights are important, but for example I have also myself some photos about which the photographer has said that no crediting needed. It might be a bit hard to prove if a photo is legal or not.

I always put the photographers link on my page with credits and on the horses page to be sure I haven't forgotten anything. I think it's better to give credit to the photographer on every horse's page

[gespenst, FIN (admin)]

Oct 23, 2011 22:01:25 GMT Leila (GER) said:

Oct 23, 2011 6:17:43 GMT gespenst, FIN (admin) said:

Heikku, the photos count in the Evaluation part ; )
Copyrights are important, but for example I have also myself some photos about which the photographer has said that no crediting needed. It might be a bit hard to prove if a photo is legal or not.

I always put the photographers link on my page with credits and on the horses page to be sure I haven't forgotten anything. I think it's better to give credit to the photographer on every horse's page

I do credit photographers whenever there is nothing else said. But when the photographer asks me to not credit her in any name? I can only have something like "photographer doesn't want to be named" or something like that.

What I meant is there is no sure way to prove the (il)legality of a photo, even if credits are there. Well, there is, but in a test like this it takes too much time to check it from every horse separately.

[Heikku [fin]]

Mostly the photographers/farm owners forgot to ask for that, it's polite to mark them anyway. It's another thing when they say that please don't mark.me under the photos - but then there should be "© photographer don't want his/her name in public"

[gespenst, FIN (admin)]

Yes, that's true = ) But my point is, that a copyright displayed doesn't always prove the legality. Giving points for copyrights doesn't have meaning, if someone hasn't really got a permission for a photo and she just fakes the credit then.

[Heikku [fin]]

But it's more likely that the person have the permission when he/she credits the photo than when he/she doesn't credit the photo

[gespenst, FIN (admin)]

You are definitely right, but we can never be 100% sure without a more or less massive investigation. That's the problem.

[gespenst, FIN (admin)]

More comments, ideas? Anyone even interested in this, or should I throw the though to the trash straight away?

[Leila (GER)]

I think I don't need this for my horses, I think it would be better to concentrate on the evaluations and shows on this board to bring life back too this community

[Nessa (GER)]

Nov 6, 2011 15:27:07 GMT Leila (GER) said:

I think it would be better to concentrate on the evaluations and shows on this board to bring life back too this community

seconded

Though I have to admit your idea sounds good, Gespenst

[pushet]

the swedish SIM- premium system (not to mix up with our Exteriour-rewarding system) is based upon the RL premium system (the have the same thing in at least Germany with horses that gains "state premiums"/verband blahahah, can't remember what it's called anyways, one shortening of it is St.Pr).

The system was made IRL to keep track of all horses used for breeding and to keep up the quality of the horses. IRL there are different kinds of premium-shows, but SISF uses a simplified version of the premium system.

The basics of the premium-grading is based upon the offsprings achievements and evaluations.
Depending on the offsprings a horse can lower or higher it's Letter of Value.
So it doesn't really have much to do with the pedigree (apart from the horse not being crossbred of course)

I like the idea of points for behaviour under saddle since it's a bit more realistic but I'm not sure it would be easy to carry out.
Otherwise I think the pointscales are too low and in other words too easy to achieve well on.
In a way, the SIM-premiums is a carrot to get members more active and it should not be something that is easy to achieve.

[pushet]

oh yeah, forgot to say, in the old times in Swedish-SIM (when we had a lot of active members) we used to have the same kind of Qualitytests that you want to arrange.
We still have them sometimes but it's not the same.

Anyways, these events were also based on the RL quality tests and the horses were given points for exteriour, behaviour in hand and under saddle and depending on whether it was a showjumper or dressage horse it was also given points for talent, and all these numbers summed up different winners.

But these tests were more like a Goldstar and a fun but different competition and did not matter at all in breeding or premium of the parents.
Personally I think it would be fun if events like these DID give extra points to the horse itself and it's parents. Just like in RL.

But we're online in a fake world, and no matter how hard we try I think people will always choose to breed horses that "they have fallen for" rather than go after the facts, pedigree and evaluations...

[Kiira (FIN)]

Sounds great! If you need a judge, I'm a volunteer